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Bart Katz
QUOTE (TruthTrekker @ Dec 27 2007, 11:57 PM) *
I know. I have calmed down over the years, but some stuff still sets me off.


I rented a condo in Fla and the parking spaces were kinda small. The people next door were from Canada and had a big ole van. I asked the guy if he could move up a little so I could park. He went into a long story about how the spaces were too small, etc etc. And I could park across the drive. I didn't want to ruin my week there so I obliged. The morning I left I put a roofing nail in front of one of his tires.
BrooklynBill
QUOTE (Bart Katz @ Dec 28 2007, 05:00 AM) *
I rented a condo in Fla and the parking spaces were kinda small. The people next door were from Canada and had a big ole van. I asked the guy if he could move up a little so I could park. He went into a long story about how the spaces were too small, etc etc. And I could park across the drive. I didn't want to ruin my week there so I obliged. The morning I left I put a roofing nail in front of one of his tires.


Nice. fark him.

I don't know why people can be so difficult. If he asked me, I would have tried to be more civilized. This guy has two cars and doesn't want to pay extra for parking. He has done this to others in the complex as well. Farking Albanians, I hate those pricks to begin with. I thought I left them behind in Italy. . laugh.gif
Arturo_Vandelay
QUOTE (TruthTrekker @ Dec 27 2007, 09:43 PM) *
Again, I apologize. I had a problem today with my neighbor. He keeps parking in my space(paid for on monthly basis as part of my rent in my apartment complex) and today he mouthed off to my girlfriend. I almost kicked his door in and the pussy called the cops, instead of being a man. The cops came, talked to us, and took down our information. What really set my off was this Albanian scumbags attitude towards my girlfriend. I wanted to push this guys face into the back of his skull. He called my girlfriend a whiny bitch. I wanted to kill this guy, I still do. I know this isn't an excuse, so I apologize if I came across like an a-hole. I also apologized to Katz as well.


We don't have to be nice all the time, or at all. Just don't get yourself arrested. Some folks are happy to provoke things even if they come out on the losing end.

I had that same call the cops thing happen with my wife's bf. And that bastard shook my hand right before he called them on me.
patheticJT
QUOTE (Bart Katz @ Dec 28 2007, 05:00 AM) *
I rented a condo in Fla and the parking spaces were kinda small. The people next door were from Canada and had a big ole van. I asked the guy if he could move up a little so I could park. He went into a long story about how the spaces were too small, etc etc. And I could park across the drive. I didn't want to ruin my week there so I obliged. The morning I left I put a roofing nail in front of one of his tires.



I worked in a tire shop busting tires in college. I had that little tool to pulll the pins out of where you put the air in tires. A guy kept parking his car in our spot at the dorm. one night I pulled all the pins out of his tires. all four tires flat. he had a hard time getting to work that day. tongue.gif

Never parked in our spot again.
BrooklynBill
QUOTE (Arturo_Vandelay @ Dec 28 2007, 05:07 AM) *
We don't have to be nice all the time, or at all. Just don't get yourself arrested. Some folks are happy to provoke things even if they come out on the losing end.

I had that same call the cops thing happen with my wife's bf. And that bastard shook my hand right before he called them on me.


He tried the assault route with the cops. He came out of the apartment, got in my face, so I headbutted him really hard. He ran into his apartment. At this point, I'm in warrior mode. I then started kicking his door. He then proceeded to shout: "I'm calling the farking cops". I said: "Go ahead, you farked with the wrong bull, the cops can't save you". My girlfriend flew out of the apartment yelling and screaming. She told him to jump off the balcony and run because she said I was going to kill him. She finally calmed me down.
Bart Katz
QUOTE (patheticJT @ Dec 28 2007, 12:10 AM) *
I worked in a tire shop busting tires in college. I had that little tool to pulll the pins out of where you put the air in tires. A guy kept parking his car in our spot at the dorm. one night I pulled all the pins out of his tires. all four tires flat. he had a hard time getting to work that day. tongue.gif

Never parked in our spot again.


LOL. I had some valve caps that had that remover thing on the end. They were at home in the garage though.
patheticJT
Memo to Reid, Pelosi & Co.
By Michael Reagan
Thursday, December 27, 2007

What happened in Pakistan today is just more proof that when it comes to the war on terrorism, the Democrats are so terribly wrong-headed that they constitute a serious threat to the security of the American people -- that's you and me.

The assassination of former Pakistani Prime Minister Benazir Bhutto is just another message -- if any more are needed -- that we are involved in a global war with an enemy that has no morals, no scruples and no respect for human life.

We can expect that the message will go undelivered to the national leadership of the Democratic party, which has shown a reckless disregard to any hints that hard-headed U.S. policy vis-à-vis Islamic terrorism is right and is justified.

In stubborn resistance to reality, Congressional Democrats have steadfastly clung to the notion that the Bush administration is wrong in its determination to face the war being forced on us by worldwide Islamo-fascism and expend its energies in fighting it wherever is with all that is required.

The Democrats, on the other hand, have turned a blind eye to the true nature of the war, especially in their insistence that the war in Iraq is not part of the total war and wants us out, pronto, leaving Iraq to deal with a threat it is not yet able to deal with.

Their myopia over Iraq and the need to pursue an aggressive strategy to root out and destroy the enemy wherever he is, as we are now doing with the surge in Iraq, is not limited to that struggle. It seems that whenever tough measures are called for, they rise up in strident opposition.

Such is the case in Pakistan, where Nancy Pelosi not long ago expressed her disapproval of Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf's hard-line stance towards the huge radical element in his country, where polls show that fully 48 percent of the population favors al Qaeda and the Taliban.

When Musharraf imposed emergency rule and suspended his nation's constitution in the face of massive unrest in Pakistan, Pelosi -- who seems to labor under the misapprehension that among her roles is secretary of state for Capitol Hill -- let loose with this broadside, pinning the blame on the Bush Administration, which she neglected to note shared her unhappiness with Musharraf's actions, but not her stridency:

"For too long, President Musharraf failed to confront effectively his growing unpopularity" Madame Pelosi said. "The Bush Administration enabled Musharraf's delusion by ignoring his undemocratic acts and lack of internal support in exchange for his assistance in efforts against terrorism. Pakistan will only be a reliable and capable ally against terrorism when its government is not seen as an enemy by its own people," Pelosi added.

This in the face of that near-majority of the population that sees its government as the real enemy and supports al Qaeda, which wants to kill us all and has tried nine times to kill Pervez Musharraf, who just happens to be our sole hope of keeping order in a nuclear-armed Pakistan and preventing the horrendous Taliban from re-conquering Afghanistan.

War, as the Kennedys used to say about politics, "ain't beanbag." Victory does not go to the fainthearted. And like it or not, what we face in Pakistan and Afghanistan and Iraq, and in a lot of other troubled areas of the world, is all-out war. Musharraf understands that.

Wherever we are engaged in that war the Democratic party, now thoroughly in the hands of the greatest conglomeration of fanatic far-out left-wingers in all creation, prefers to treat the struggle as if it were beanbag, where one plays by gentlemanly rules even as the enemy kills people in suicide bombings or chopping off heads.

Pakistan is not an isolated case. We are as much at war there, by proxy, as we are in Afghanistan where our troops battle the Taliban. If we lose Pakistan, al Qaeda could be the world's ninth nuclear power, and playing the Democrats' game of beanbag could threaten us with mushroom clouds over Manhattan.

As the Nixon folks used to say, when the going gets tough, the tough get going -- if they want to survive, that is. For today's Democrats, when the going gets tough, it's time to wring your hands and tsk-tsk while the tough get going
Nomarchy
I know all people from all nationalities are entitled to the same basic level of dignified treatment and all that good, virtuous stuff plus I do know a few Albanians who are just regular folks, good and bad like the rest of us. Still, there's something terribly ANNOYING about Albanians.
hunin
I've noticed that on occasion as well. Curious.

~~~~~~~~~~~~

QUOTE (TruthTrekker @ Dec 27 2007, 10:43 PM) *
Again, I apologize. I had a problem today with my neighbor. He keeps parking in my space(paid for on monthly basis as part of my rent in my apartment complex) and today he mouthed off to my girlfriend. I almost kicked his door in and the pussy called the cops, instead of being a man. The cops came, talked to us, and took down our information. What really set my off was this Albanian scumbags attitude towards my girlfriend. I wanted to push this guys face into the back of his skull. He called my girlfriend a whiny bitch. I wanted to kill this guy, I still do. I know this isn't an excuse, so I apologize if I came across like an a-hole. I also apologized to Katz as well.


Violence is not the answer. Esp w/prompt 911 responders.

You may want to consider more subtle ways to make his life miserable. wink.gif


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

QUOTE
ISLAMABAD -- The assassination of charismatic Pakistani opposition leader Benazir Bhutto has thrown the nuclear-armed country into one of the worst crises in its 60-year history, with deadly riots raising the spectre of widespread civil chaos.

As Pakistan began three days of mourning for the former prime minister, anger over her death triggered violence across the country. Grief-stricken supporters burned vehicles and buildings, blocked roads and screamed abuse at U.S.-backed President Pervez Musharraf....




No one has claimed responsibility for the killing but Bhutto was an outspoken opponent of al-Qaeda-linked Islamic extremists blamed for scores of bombings in Pakistan, and she had received death threats from militant groups. And Bhutto's political opponents and those close to Musharraf's political party can't be ruled out of suspicion, analysts said.

"It's going to be very difficult to establish the truth of who was behind this," said M.J. Gohel, the executive director of the Asia-Pacific Foundation, a security and intelligence think-tank in London.

Bhutto had accused elements of the intelligence services of involvement in a suicide attack on her convoy in Karachi on Oct. 18 as she returned from exile. She narrowly escaped death, but the attack left 139 people dead.

After her death yesterday, close aides released an e-mail in which she accused Musharraf of deliberately failing to provide adequate security.

Bhutto's U.S. spokesman Mark Siegel told CNN she had asked authorities to provide protection including a four-car police escort and jamming devices against bombs, but that she had not received them.

If harmed in Pakistan, "I wld (would) hold Musharaf (sic) responsible," Bhutto wrote in an October e-mail made public by Siegel....


Interior Ministry spokesman Javed Cheema said 10 people died in the unrest after her death -- four in Karachi, four in rural Sindh province in the south and two in Lahore. The violence continued today as unidentified gunmen shot and killed a police officer in Bhutto's stronghold in Karachi, police said.

"Unknown people gunned down a police constable in Lyari this morning," said senior police official Fayyaz Khan, referring to a poor city neighbourhood and a bastion of Bhutto support....





http://www.canada.com/victoriatimescolonis...4f5&k=16995
Lord_Proprietor
QUOTE (patheticJT @ Dec 28 2007, 01:46 AM) *
Memo to Reid, Pelosi & Co.
By Michael Reagan
Thursday, December 27, 2007

What happened in Pakistan today is just more proof that when it comes to the war on terrorism, the Democrats are so terribly wrong-headed that they constitute a serious threat to the security of the American people -- that's you and me.

The assassination of former Pakistani Prime Minister Benazir Bhutto is just another message -- if any more are needed -- that we are involved in a global war with an enemy that has no morals, no scruples and no respect for human life.

We can expect that the message will go undelivered to the national leadership of the Democratic party, which has shown a reckless disregard to any hints that hard-headed U.S. policy vis-à-vis Islamic terrorism is right and is justified.

In stubborn resistance to reality, Congressional Democrats have steadfastly clung to the notion that the Bush administration is wrong in its determination to face the war being forced on us by worldwide Islamo-fascism and expend its energies in fighting it wherever is with all that is required.

The Democrats, on the other hand, have turned a blind eye to the true nature of the war, especially in their insistence that the war in Iraq is not part of the total war and wants us out, pronto, leaving Iraq to deal with a threat it is not yet able to deal with.

Their myopia over Iraq and the need to pursue an aggressive strategy to root out and destroy the enemy wherever he is, as we are now doing with the surge in Iraq, is not limited to that struggle. It seems that whenever tough measures are called for, they rise up in strident opposition.

Such is the case in Pakistan, where Nancy Pelosi not long ago expressed her disapproval of Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf's hard-line stance towards the huge radical element in his country, where polls show that fully 48 percent of the population favors al Qaeda and the Taliban.

When Musharraf imposed emergency rule and suspended his nation's constitution in the face of massive unrest in Pakistan, Pelosi -- who seems to labor under the misapprehension that among her roles is secretary of state for Capitol Hill -- let loose with this broadside, pinning the blame on the Bush Administration, which she neglected to note shared her unhappiness with Musharraf's actions, but not her stridency:

"For too long, President Musharraf failed to confront effectively his growing unpopularity" Madame Pelosi said. "The Bush Administration enabled Musharraf's delusion by ignoring his undemocratic acts and lack of internal support in exchange for his assistance in efforts against terrorism. Pakistan will only be a reliable and capable ally against terrorism when its government is not seen as an enemy by its own people," Pelosi added.

This in the face of that near-majority of the population that sees its government as the real enemy and supports al Qaeda, which wants to kill us all and has tried nine times to kill Pervez Musharraf, who just happens to be our sole hope of keeping order in a nuclear-armed Pakistan and preventing the horrendous Taliban from re-conquering Afghanistan.

War, as the Kennedys used to say about politics, "ain't beanbag." Victory does not go to the fainthearted. And like it or not, what we face in Pakistan and Afghanistan and Iraq, and in a lot of other troubled areas of the world, is all-out war. Musharraf understands that.

Wherever we are engaged in that war the Democratic party, now thoroughly in the hands of the greatest conglomeration of fanatic far-out left-wingers in all creation, prefers to treat the struggle as if it were beanbag, where one plays by gentlemanly rules even as the enemy kills people in suicide bombings or chopping off heads.

Pakistan is not an isolated case. We are as much at war there, by proxy, as we are in Afghanistan where our troops battle the Taliban. If we lose Pakistan, al Qaeda could be the world's ninth nuclear power, and playing the Democrats' game of beanbag could threaten us with mushroom clouds over Manhattan.

As the Nixon folks used to say, when the going gets tough, the tough get going -- if they want to survive, that is. For today's Democrats, when the going gets tough, it's time to wring your hands and tsk-tsk while the tough get going




During the eight years of the Clintons, the terrorists got away with everything and build up their forces without any checks on them from the western world!
Arturo_Vandelay
QUOTE (TruthTrekker @ Dec 27 2007, 10:13 PM) *
He tried the assault route with the cops. He came out of the apartment, got in my face, so I headbutted him really hard. He ran into his apartment. At this point, I'm in warrior mode. I then started kicking his door. He then proceeded to shout: "I'm calling the farking cops". I said: "Go ahead, you farked with the wrong bull, the cops can't save you". My girlfriend flew out of the apartment yelling and screaming. She told him to jump off the balcony and run because she said I was going to kill him. She finally calmed me down.


Be careful. A parking spot isn't worth getting arrested over. Worse yet the weaselly types get back at people with cheap shots instead of going head to head.
underhi2p
QUOTE (Spot @ Dec 27 2007, 10:51 PM) *
I can't find a 'good guy' anywhere in Pakistan.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,318525,00.html

Bhutto was unable to do much to combat Pakistan's widespread poverty, governmental corruption and increasing crime. In August 1990 the president of Pakistan, Ghulam Ishaq Khan, dismissed her government on charges of corruption and other malfeasance and called for new elections. Bhutto's PPP suffered a defeat in the national elections of October 1990; thereafter she led the parliamentary opposition against her successor, Nawaz Sharif.

In elections in October 1993 the PPP won a plurality of votes, and Bhutto again became head of a coalition government. Under renewed allegations of corruption, economic mismanagement and a decline of law and order, her government was dismissed in November 1996 by President Farooq Leghari.

Voter turnout was low in the 1997 elections, in which Bhutto's PPP suffered a decisive loss to Sharif's Pakistan Muslim League party. With British and Swiss cooperation, Sharif's administration continued to pursue the corruption charges against Bhutto. In 1999 Bhutto and her husband, the controversial businessman and senator, Asif Ali Zardari, jailed since 1996 on a variety of additional charges, both were convicted of corruption by a Lahore court, a decision overturned by the Supreme Court in 2001 because of evidence of governmental interference.

Bhutto did not achieve political accommodation with Gen. Pervez Musharraf's seizure of power in a 1999 coup d'état; her demands that the charges against her and her husband be dropped were denied, undercutting negotiations with the Musharraf government regarding a return to the country from her self-imposed exile. Facing standing arrest warrants should she return to Pakistan, Bhutto remained in exile in London and Dubai from the late 1990s.

Because of Musharraf's 2002 decree banning former prime ministers from holding a third term, Bhutto was not permitted to stand for elections that same year. In addition, legislation in 2000 that prohibited a court-convicted individual from holding party office hindered her party, as Bhutto's unanimously elected leadership would have excluded the PPP from participating in elections.

In response to these obstacles, the PPP split, registering a new, legally distinct branch called the Pakistan People's Party Parliamentarians (PPPP). Legally separate and free from the restrictions brought upon the PPP by Bhutto's leadership, the PPPP participated in the 2002 elections, in which it proceeded to earn a strong vote. However, Bhutto's terms for cooperation with the military government, that all charges against her and against her husband be withdrawn, continued to be denied. In 2004 Bhutto's husband was released from prison on bail and joined Bhutto in exile. Just before the 2007 elections, talk began to circulate of Bhutto's return to Pakistan.

Shortly before Musharraf's re-election to the presidency, amid unresolved discussions of a power-sharing deal between Bhutto and Musharraf's military regime, he finally granted Bhutto a long-sought amnesty for the corruption charges brought against her by the Sharif administration.

The Supreme Court challenged Musharraf's right to grant the amnesty, however, criticizing it as unconstitutional; nevertheless, in October 2007 Bhutto returned to Karachi from Dubai after eight years of self-imposed exile.



Pakistan needs a Gay and Lesbian lobby, an Abortion lobby, an Atheism lobby, a National Organization for Women lobby to take some focus off of all this religious hate.

Arturo_Vandelay
http://www.slate.com/id/2180951/

Some have suggested that Musharraf could use Bhutto's assassination as a pretense to postpone the elections and reimpose a state of emergency. In fact, the retired general is caught in a precarious position. If he doesn't delay the elections, the opposition will accuse him of being callous. They'll want to know how they can possibly campaign in an environment where memories of Bhutto's murder are so fresh. But if he delays the elections, they'll accuse him of trying to hijack the democratic process. The fact remains that Musharraf needed Bhutto. Without her on the scene, his choices look grim. The gloom I felt on those winding back roads of the North West Frontier Province may be present in the lavish chambers of the presidential palace tonight.
SpaceCowboy
Damned if he does and damned if he doesn't.
Arturo_Vandelay
QUOTE (SpaceCowboy @ Dec 28 2007, 04:04 PM) *
Damned if he does and damned if he doesn't.


That's exactly the political "fork" I've complained about here in the past. At least it's classical partisan politics and not civil war. Frustrating for sure, but it may be a lot better than the many bad alternatives.
SpaceCowboy
QUOTE (Arturo_Vandelay @ Dec 28 2007, 05:16 PM) *
That's exactly the political "fork" I've complained about here in the past. At least it's classical partisan politics and not civil war. Frustrating for sure, but it may be a lot better than the many bad alternatives.

What's the point in holding the elections on time if the principal opposition leader has just been assassinated?
Bart Katz
QUOTE (SpaceCowboy @ Dec 28 2007, 06:24 PM) *
What's the point in holding the elections on time if the principal opposition leader has just been assassinated?


Wouldn't you have to have an elected leader before you could have another coup?
SpaceCowboy
QUOTE (Bart Katz @ Dec 28 2007, 05:25 PM) *
Wouldn't you have to have an elected leader before you could have another coup?

laugh.gif
Bart Katz
Arturo_Vandelay
QUOTE (SpaceCowboy @ Dec 28 2007, 04:24 PM) *
What's the point in holding the elections on time if the principal opposition leader has just been assassinated?



Anything to that effect in OUR Constitution?
SpaceCowboy
QUOTE (Arturo_Vandelay @ Dec 28 2007, 05:38 PM) *
Anything to that effect in OUR Constitution?

Nope.
SpaceCowboy
Pakistan: Bhutto Died of Skull Fracture
Dec 28 12:21 PM US/Eastern
By MUNIR AHMAD
Associated Press Writer

ISLAMABAD, Pakistan (AP) - Benazir Bhutto died from a skull fracture suffered when her head slammed against her car during a suicide attack—not from bullet wounds, the government said Friday.

Pakistan's interior minister blamed al-Qaida and the Taliban for Thursday's assassination and said another key opposition leader, Nawaz Sharif, is also under threat of militant attack.

The government released a transcript Friday of a purported conversation between militant leader Baitullah Mehsud and another militant.

"It was a spectacular job. They were very brave boys who killed her," Mehsud said, according to the transcript.

Authorities on Thursday said Bhutto died from bullet wounds fired by a young man who then blew himself up, killing 20 other people. A surgeon who treated her said Friday she died from the impact of shrapnel on her skull.

But later Friday, Interior Ministry spokesman Javed Iqbal Cheema said all three shots missed her as she greeted supporters through the sunroof of her vehicle, which was bulletproof and bombproof.

He also denied that shrapnel caused her death, saying Bhutto was killed when she tried to duck back into the vehicle, and the shock waves from the blast knocked her head into a lever attached to the sunroof, fracturing her skull.

At a news conference, Cheema played a videotape of the attack showing Bhutto waving, smiling and chatting with supporters from the sunroof as her car sat unmoving on the street outside a campaign rally. Three gunshots rang out, the camera appeared to fall, and the tape ended.

Bhutto was slain while campaigning for the crucial Jan. 8 parliamentary elections in which she hoped to return as prime minister of the nuclear-armed country, a key U.S. ally in the war on terrorism. Upon her return from exile in October, she survived an assassination attempt. She had repeatedly complained that the government of Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf did not give her adequate security.

As word of her death spread, her supporters blamed Musharraf of complicity in her assassination.

On Friday, Interior Minister Hamid Nawaz told The Associated Press that the government had evidence that al-Qaida and Taliban were behind the suicide attack.

Later, Cheema blamed Mehsud, described him as an "al-Qaida leader" and said he was also behind the Oct. 18 bombing against Bhutto's homecoming parade through Karachi that killed more than 140 people.

Mehsud is a commander of pro-Taliban forces in the lawless Pakistani tribal region South Waziristan, where al-Qaida fighters are also active. His forces often attack Pakistani security forces.

This fall, he was quoted in a Pakistani newspaper as saying that he would welcome Bhutto's return from exile with suicide bombers. Mehsud later denied that in statements to local television and newspaper reporters.

Cheema said Mehsud was "behind most of the recent terrorist attacks that have taken place in Pakistan."

He said Pakistani security forces would hunt down those responsible for Bhutto's death.

Cheema also said Sharif—also a former prime minister and now the most prominent opposition leader in Pakistan—was among several politicians under threat of militant attack.

He named others as Fazlur Rehman, the leader of an Islamist opposition party; former Railways Minister Sheikh Rashid Ahmed, a close ally of President Pervez Musharraf; and former Interior Minister Aftab Sherpao, who narrowly escaped a suicide bombing last weekend that killed 56 people.

(all) http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D8...;show_article=1
SpaceCowboy
Row breaks out over Benazir Bhutto's death

By Isambard Wilkinson, Pakistan Correspondent, and Bonnie Malkin
Last Updated: 6:24pm GMT 28/12/2007

The burial of Benzair Bhutto was today marred by heavy violence across Pakistan as a bitter row broke out over how she died.

As hundreds of thousands mourned the murdered opposition leader, the country's Interior Ministry claimed she had died from hitting her vehicle's sunroof when she tried to duck after a suicide attack.

However, one of Miss Bhutto's aide rejected the government's explanation of her death as a "pack of lies".

Brigadier Javed Cheema, a ministry spokesman, said Miss Bhutto had died from a head wound she sustained when she smashed against the sunroof's lever as she tried to shelter inside the car.

"The lever struck near her right ear and fractured her skull," Mr Cheema said.

But the explanation was ridiculed by Farooq Naik, Miss Bhutto's top lawyer and a senior official in her Pakistan People's Party.

"It is baseless. It is a pack of lies," he said.

"Two bullets hit her, one in the abdomen and one in the head. It was a serious security lapse."

The dispute came as Pakistani security forces were given orders to shoot on sight in an attempt to curb unrest as millions across the country mourned Miss Bhutto.

The former prime minister and leading opposition figure was laid to rest in her family's mausoleum a day after her assassination by Islamic extremists.

Her simple coffin, draped in the red, green and black flag of her Pakistan People's Party, was greeted by huge crowds at her ancestral grave in the village of Garhi Khuda Bakhsh in the southern province of Sind.

Accompanied by her husband, Asif Ali Zardari, and three children, her body was carried in a white ambulance as it made its way towards the white Mogulesque mausoleum surrounded by hundreds of thousands of mourners.

As she was being laid to rest alongside the tombs of her father and two brothers, her furious supporters across the country ransacked banks, waged shootouts with police and burned stations in a spasm of violence that threatened to plunge the country into deep turmoil less than two weeks before a crucial election.


Paramilitary rangers were given the authority to use live rounds to stop rioters from damaging property in southern Pakistan. "We have orders to shoot on sight," said Major Asad Ali, the rangers' spokesman.

The shooting and suicide bomb attack that killed Miss Bhutto and 20 others has badly damaged President Pervez Musharraf's plans to "restore democracy" in nuclear-armed Pakistan, a key US ally in the war on terrorism.

He has blamed the attack on Islamic militants based near the country's border with Afghanistan, and pledged to "root them out", but an Interior Ministry spokesman today suggested al-Qa'eda may have been responsible.

"Benazir has been on the hit-list of al-Qa'eda," Brigadier Javed Cheema said. "Now there is every possibility that al-Qa'eda is behind this tragic attack to undermine the security of Pakistan."

(more) http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml...wbhutto1228.xml
beasty
Buried under the party flag. That says something, but I'm not sure exactly what.
Nomarchy
QUOTE (Arturo_Vandelay @ Dec 28 2007, 01:36 PM) *
Be careful. A parking spot isn't worth getting arrested over. Worse yet the weaselly types get back at people with cheap shots instead of going head to head.


Sage advice.
BrooklynBill
QUOTE (Nomarchy @ Dec 29 2007, 01:07 AM) *
Sage advice.


Indeed.

Friend Judy
This is no doubt a dumb question, but why are banks and transit stations the targets of choice for Pakistani rioters?
Arturo_Vandelay
QUOTE (Friend Judy @ Dec 28 2007, 06:28 PM) *
This is no doubt a dumb question, but why are banks and transit stations the targets of choice for Pakistani rioters?


I think it's a good question. Banks I can see. People hoping to get free samples. Maybe Muslims of the more backwards variety have something against transportation hubs. 9/11 not a fluke perhaps?
hunin
QUOTE (SpaceCowboy @ Dec 28 2007, 05:04 PM) *
Damned if he does and damned if he doesn't.


He may well be damned regardless.

He's got a long trail of deeds.
hunin
QUOTE (SpaceCowboy @ Dec 28 2007, 05:24 PM) *
What's the point in holding the elections on time if the principal opposition leader has just been assassinated?


And the other's refusing to participate?

Well, there is WINNING. There is that, yes?

Some 30 other minor parties in the mix the PAK ambassador said tonite on the NewsHour. So there's democracy. unsure.gif

hunin
QUOTE (Bart Katz @ Dec 28 2007, 05:25 PM) *
Wouldn't you have to have an elected leader before you could have another coup?


Not really.

The Shah wasn't elected.
hunin
QUOTE (Friend Judy @ Dec 28 2007, 07:28 PM) *
This is no doubt a dumb question, but why are banks and transit stations the targets of choice for Pakistani rioters?


Where the money is?

Opportunistic rioters. Not uncommon.
Bart Katz
QUOTE (hunin @ Dec 28 2007, 09:14 PM) *
Not really.

The Shah wasn't elected.


We're talking Pakistan, now. They supposed to be gonna have elections.
hunin
A coup is just a forced regime change.

Now, Musharraf couldn't coup himself of course. But the military could.
Friend Judy
Ah! Mystery of "why banks" is solved. Seems that throughout the 1990s and early oughts, the formerly mostly-nationalized banks were privatized and virtually completely deregulated. Most (85%) of the new banks ended up foreign-owned or controlled, and they're reaping unconscionable "profits": 26.1% return on equity in 2006. The privatization of the banks is being heralded as a grand success by Musharraf's administration, but the high interest rates being paid to (perceived) foreigners is resented by the general population.

Also, it seems Musharraf/his finance minister have been routing development funds to cronies, and banks have been calling in loans on political opponents.

And thirdly, it's widely believed by Bhutto's supporters that the documents related to the charges Bhutto and her husband embezzled on a grand scale were falsified by the Finance ministry.

So that would be why banks. Now for some research into why transit stations.
hunin
They're universally irritating?
Bart Katz
Why do you loot banks?





























That's where the money is.
Lord_Proprietor
CNN and Hillary Destabilize Pakistan

Accuracy In Media, by Cliff Kincaid


12/29/2007 10:15:20 AM

In the wake of Benazir Bhutto’s assassination, Wolf Blitzer of CNN made much of an e-mail, exclusively provided to him by a close associate of Bhutto and a Hillary Clinton supporter, casting blame on Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf for her murder. We can now understand why Musharraf’s November 3 state-of-emergency decree took foreign news outlets like CNN off the air.
Friend Judy
The banks are closed and the money is in the vaults. That's why I was wondering why they would be burning banks.

Still wondering why railroad stations are a target of choice.
Bart Katz
The bank thing was a joke. Willie Sutton I belive.

Rioting at mass transit stations disrupts the entire economy.

If you gonna do bombings, transit stations is where the people are.
BrooklynBill
Police abandoned security posts before Bhutto assassination
12/28/2007 @ 10:56 am
Filed by Nick Juliano

No autopsy performed on body; docs say bullet wounds not found

Police abandoned their security posts shortly before Pakistani opposition leader Benazir Bhutto's assassination Thursday, according to a journalist present at the time, and unanswerable questions remain about the cause of her death, because an autopsy was never performed.

Pakistan's Interior Minister on Friday said that Bhutto was not killed by gunshots, as had been widely reported, and doctors at Rawalpindi General Hospital, where she died, say there were no bullet marks on the former prime minister's body, according to India's IBNLive.com. Furthermore, according to the news agency, there was no formal autopsy performed on Bhutto's body before she was buried Friday.

CNN is now reporting that it wasn't gunshots or shrapnel that killed Bhutto, but that she died from hitting the sunroof of the car she was riding in. The network said sources in Pakistan's Interior Ministry said nothing entered her skull, no bullets or shrapnel.

Apparently there was some kind of lever on the sunroof she was standing through, and she hit her head on that CNN reported Friday morning.

Earlier in the day Interior Minister Hamid Nawaz told a Pakistani news channel, “The report says she had head injuries – an irregular patch – and the X-ray doesn’t show any bullet in the head. So it was probably the shrapnel or any other thing has struck her in her said. That damaged her brain, causing it to ooze and her death. The report categorically says there’s no wound other than that," according to IBNLive.

Perhaps more shockingly, an attendee at the rally where Bhutto was killed says police charged with protecting her "abandoned their posts," leaving just a handful of Bhutto's own bodyguards protecting her.

"Police officers had frisked the 3,000 to 4,000 people attending Thursday's rally when they entered the park, but as the speakers from Bhutto's Pakistan People's Party droned on, the police abandoned many of their posts," wrote Saeed Shah in an essay published by McClatchy News Service. "As she drove out through the gate, her main protection appeared to be her own bodyguards, who wore their usual white T-shirts inscribed: 'Willing to die for Benazir.'"

While some intelligence officials, especially within the US, were quick to finger al Qaeda militants as responsible for Bhutto's death, it remains unclear precisely who was responsible and some speculation has centered on Pakistan's intelligence service, the ISI, its military or even forces loyal to the current president Pervez Musharraf. Rawalpindi, where Bhutto was killed, is the garrison city that houses the Pakistani military's headquarters.

"GHQ (general headquarters of the army) killed her," Sardar Saleem, a former member of parliament, told Shah at the hospital.

Whatever the case, Bhutto's precise cause of death may never be known because of the failure to administer an autopsy. The procedure was not carried out because police and local authorities in Rawalpindi did not request one, according to IBNLive, but the government plans a formal investigation why this was the case.

Musharraf initially blamed her death on unnamed Islamic militants, but Interior Minister Hamid Nawaz told The Associated Press on Friday that "we have the evidence that al-Qaida and the Taliban were behind the suicide attack on Benazir Bhutto."

He said investigators had resolved the "whole mystery" behind the opposition leader's killing and would give details at press conference later Friday.

DEVELOPING...

http://rawstory.com//printstory.php?story=8708
BrooklynBill
Bhutto email named killers weeks before assassination
SIMON WALTERS -Daily Mail
Sunday, December 30, 2007


Benazir Bhutto claimed three senior allies of Pakistan's president General Musharraf were out to kill her in a secret email to Foreign Secretary David Miliband written weeks before her death.

Astonishingly, one of them is a leading intelligence officer who was officially responsible for protecting Miss Bhutto from an assassination.

The second is a prominent Pakistani figure, one of whose family members was allegedly murdered by a militant group run by Miss Bhutto's brother. The third is a well-known chief minister in Pakistan who is a long-standing opponent of Miss Bhutto.


Miss Bhutto told Mr Miliband she was convinced that the three were determined to assassinate her on her return to the country and pleaded with him to put pressure on the Pakistan government to stop them.

The disclosure is bound to lead to questions as to whether the Foreign Office did enough to safeguard Miss Bhutto.

Her return was organised in close co-ordination with the UK and US governments, which saw her as the best hope of restoring democracy in Pakistan while preventing it from falling into the hands of Islamic extremists.

The email concerning the three alleged would-be killers identified by Miss Bhutto emerged as rival political factions in Pakistan continued to dispute the details surrounding her assassination.

The Pakistan government said she was killed by Al Qaeda, but her People's Party dismissed that as "a pack of lies" and insisted General Musharraf's regime was implicated.

Wajid Shamsul Hasan, Pakistan's former High Commissioner to the UK and a British-based adviser to Miss Bhutto, said: "She sent an email to the Foreign Office before she returned to Pakistan naming certain people.

"In the email, she said, 'The following persons are planning to murder me and if any harm comes to me they should be held responsible.'"

Miss Bhutto wrote her prophetic email to Mr Miliband in September, shortly after she met him to discuss her return to Pakistan. She named the same three individuals in a letter to General Musharraf in October.

The Mail on Sunday has been informed of the names but has decided not to publish them.

One is a senior intelligence officer and retired army officer who worked for Pakistan's sinister Inter Services Intelligence spy agency, which has close links to the Taliban and has been involved in drug smuggling and political assassinations. He allegedly directed two Islamic terrorist groups and reportedly once boasted that he could pay money to hired killers to assassinate anyone who posed a threat to Musharraf's regime.

He was given another senior intelligence post by Musharraf after his bid to become a senior overseas diplomat for Pakistan failed when the host country refused to let him in because of his past activities.

He was also linked to Omar Sheikh, the former British public schoolboy convicted of kidnapping US journalist Daniel Pearl, who was murdered in 2002 by having his throat cut and being decapitated by Islamic terrorists.

The second individual named by Miss Bhutto is well known in Pakistani political circles and has been involved in a vicious family feud with her for decades.

One of his relatives was said to have been murdered by the militant Al Zulfiqar group run by Miss Bhutto's brother, Murtaza. The organisation was set up to avenge the execution of Miss Bhutto's father Zulfiqar Bhutto by ex-Pakistan dictator Zia ul Haq.

The third individual is a chief minister who has repeatedly denounced Miss Bhutto - and faced political annihilation if she won the elections scheduled for next week. He made an outspoken attack on her only hours before her death.

A senior source said: "She knew the risk she was taking when she decided to go back but also took the precaution of informing the British Government of the names of those she thought presented the biggest danger to her.

"She hoped Mr Miliband would use his influence with General Musharraf to remove certain people from positions where they were able to plot against her. She gave the same names to General Musharraf but she knew there was only a limited possibility of any action being taken.

continued....

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/arti...in_page_id=1811
Bart Katz
Clever ploy that.
Valdron
QUOTE (Bart Katz @ Dec 28 2007, 05:00 AM) *
I rented a condo in Fla and the parking spaces were kinda small. The people next door were from Canada and had a big ole van. I asked the guy if he could move up a little so I could park. He went into a long story about how the spaces were too small, etc etc. And I could park across the drive. I didn't want to ruin my week there so I obliged. The morning I left I put a roofing nail in front of one of his tires.


ROTFL!!! Excellent!!! If I was to invent the perfect Bart Katz story, I couldn't do better than that. I'm laughing here, tears rolling down my eyes, my side hurts. How pathetic can you get. What a second rate passive aggressive stunt. Such a farking coward. And you brag about it too, that's got to be the best part. Honestly, I'm glad I came back for this. You motherfarking loser.
Bart Katz
They were farking unaccomdating Canadians. Guests in our country. That was just a minor little trick.
Bee
QUOTE (Valdron @ Dec 30 2007, 05:14 PM) *
And you brag about it too, that's got to be the best part.

Yep. Unbelievable. The thing is, when you think he's hit bottom, he always manages to dig a little deeper.

Happy New Year Valdron smile.gif
BrooklynBill
QUOTE (Valdron @ Dec 30 2007, 10:14 PM) *
ROTFL!!! Excellent!!! If I was to invent the perfect Bart Katz story, I couldn't do better than that. I'm laughing here, tears rolling down my eyes, my side hurts. How pathetic can you get. What a second rate passive aggressive stunt. Such a farking coward. And you brag about it too, that's got to be the best part. Honestly, I'm glad I came back for this. You motherfarking loser.


If you fark with the bull, you get the horns. laugh.gif
Bart Katz
QUOTE (TruthTrekker @ Dec 30 2007, 05:38 PM) *
If you fark with the bull, you get the horns. laugh.gif


If it had been more serious I'd have just shoved their van down to the water as the tide was coming in..
patheticJT
QUOTE (Valdron @ Dec 30 2007, 10:14 PM) *
ROTFL!!! Excellent!!! If I was to invent the perfect Bart Katz story, I couldn't do better than that. I'm laughing here, tears rolling down my eyes, my side hurts. How pathetic can you get. What a second rate passive aggressive stunt. Such a farking coward. And you brag about it too, that's got to be the best part. Honestly, I'm glad I came back for this. You motherfarking loser.





Sounds like you need to come out for some fresh air.
Bart Katz
What with Hillary's recent claims to knowing Mrs Bhuttro quiet well, should she be added to the long list of Clinton friends and associates who have met an untimely demise?
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