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beasty
QUOTE (Lord_Proprietor @ Mar 14 2008, 01:15 PM) *
Yea, Unhuh, For setting millions of people free and spreading democratic governance all over the world since we were called in to help quelch despots in WWII!


Inyerface is against it. If you can't stop guys like Saddam and Hitler without sarcasm Inyerface is unarmed.
inyerface
yep

I'm the one
BrooklynBill
QUOTE (Lord_Proprietor @ Mar 14 2008, 08:15 PM) *
Yea, Unhuh, For setting millions of people free and spreading democratic governance all over the world since we were called in to help quelch despots in WWII!


ROFL
inyerface
we set the slaves free
inyerface
just a trail o glory aint it

Viva Grenada!
SpaceCowboy
QUOTE
On My Faith and My Church

Posted March 14, 2008 | 04:28 PM (EST)


The pastor of my church, Rev. Jeremiah Wright, who recently preached his last sermon and is in the process of retiring, has touched off a firestorm over the last few days. He's drawn attention as the result of some inflammatory and appalling remarks he made about our country, our politics, and my political opponents.

Let me say at the outset that I vehemently disagree and strongly condemn the statements that have been the subject of this controversy. I categorically denounce any statement that disparages our great country or serves to divide us from our allies. I also believe that words that degrade individuals have no place in our public dialogue, whether it's on the campaign stump or in the pulpit. In sum, I reject outright the statements by Rev. Wright that are at issue.



Because these particular statements by Rev. Wright are so contrary to my own life and beliefs, a number of people have legitimately raised questions about the nature of my relationship with Rev. Wright and my membership in the church. Let me therefore provide some context.

As I have written about in my books, I first joined Trinity United Church of Christ nearly twenty years ago. I knew Rev. Wright as someone who served this nation with honor as a United States Marine, as a respected biblical scholar, and as someone who taught or lectured at seminaries across the country, from Union Theological Seminary to the University of Chicago. He also led a diverse congregation that was and still is a pillar of the South Side and the entire city of Chicago. It's a congregation that does not merely preach social justice but acts it out each day, through ministries ranging from housing the homeless to reaching out to those with HIV/AIDS.

Most importantly, Rev. Wright preached the gospel of Jesus, a gospel on which I base my life. In other words, he has never been my political advisor; he's been my pastor. And the sermons I heard him preach always related to our obligation to love God and one another, to work on behalf of the poor, and to seek justice at every turn.

The statements that Rev. Wright made that are the cause of this controversy were not statements I personally heard him preach while I sat in the pews of Trinity or heard him utter in private conversation. When these statements first came to my attention, it was at the beginning of my presidential campaign. I made it clear at the time that I strongly condemned his comments. But because Rev. Wright was on the verge of retirement, and because of my strong links to the Trinity faith community, where I married my wife and where my daughters were baptized, I did not think it appropriate to leave the church.

Let me repeat what I've said earlier. All of the statements that have been the subject of controversy are ones that I vehemently condemn. They in no way reflect my attitudes and directly contradict my profound love for this country.

With Rev. Wright's retirement and the ascension of my new pastor, Rev. Otis Moss, III, Michelle and I look forward to continuing a relationship with a church that has done so much good. And while Rev. Wright's statements have pained and angered me, I believe that Americans will judge me not on the basis of what someone else said, but on the basis of who I am and what I believe in; on my values, judgment and experience to be President of the United States.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/barack-obama...ch_b_91623.html

QUOTE
Let me repeat what I've said earlier. All of the statements that have been the subject of controversy are ones that I vehemently condemn. They in no way reflect my attitudes and directly contradict my profound love for this country.


I love the way Obama just denies the "controversial" statements.

Oh, and by the way, if that uppity preacher said anything like that while Obama was in church he must have been asleep.
SherryB

The reason for the "black separatist" church is that blacks were not allowed in the white churches. Tradition. History. Not uppity, honest. That church was founded in the 18th century.
SpaceCowboy
QUOTE (SherryB @ Mar 14 2008, 04:22 PM) *
The reason for the "black separatist" church is that blacks were not allowed in the white churches. Tradition. History. Not uppity, honest. That church was founded in the 18th century.

I can live with Obama's choice of church. As a young Harvard grad with political ambitions, he needed an entree to the Chicago neighborhoods that showed him to be on the side of the community.
beasty
QUOTE (TruthTrekker @ Mar 14 2008, 01:53 PM) *
ROFL



Lest we forget your country was on the other side in WWII.
beasty
QUOTE (SpaceCowboy @ Mar 14 2008, 02:37 PM) *
I can live with Obama's choice of church. As a young Harvard grad with political ambitions, he needed an entree to the Chicago neighborhoods that showed him to be on the side of the community.


Can you live with his wife's salary tripling when he got elected to the senate and was in a position to earmark money for her hospital?
SherryB
QUOTE (beasty @ Mar 14 2008, 05:41 PM) *
Can you live with his wife's salary tripling when he got elected to the senate and was in a position to earmark money for her hospital?


All the hospitals. Don't fudge the details. CNN does fact checking on everything coming out.

SpaceCowboy
QUOTE (beasty @ Mar 14 2008, 04:41 PM) *
Can you live with his wife's salary tripling when he got elected to the senate and was in a position to earmark money for her hospital?

Sure. Unless folks start out rich, they will need to rely upon those advantages they have in order to move up.

More often than not, that amounts to young pols being noticed by the powerful in their communities and groomed for greater things.
SherryB


Most of his earmarks got turned down anyway. Clinton won't release the details of hers. Everything's a secret with her.
Lord_Proprietor
QUOTE (SpaceCowboy @ Mar 14 2008, 04:37 PM) *
I can live with Obama's choice of church. As a young Harvard grad with political ambitions, he needed an entree to the Chicago neighborhoods that showed him to be on the side of the community.



laugh.gif laugh.gif laugh.gif laugh.gif dry.gif
Lord_Proprietor
Tell Us Which Pastor Wright Sermons You Agree With, Senator

Just what part of this stuff shaped your views?


Where's the Sunshine and Hope?

SherryB
QUOTE (Lord_Proprietor @ Mar 14 2008, 06:08 PM) *
Tell Us Which Pastor Wright Sermons You Agree With, Senator

Just what part of this stuff shaped your views?


Where's the Sunshine and Hope?



You have a black hole for a soul.
beasty
QUOTE (SpaceCowboy @ Mar 14 2008, 02:51 PM) *
Sure. Unless folks start out rich, they will need to rely upon those advantages they have in order to move up.


No better way to move up than become a senator. Or marry one.
inyerface
or sell yourself to one

or buy one

or kill one
Nomarchy
QUOTE (beasty @ Mar 14 2008, 02:39 PM) *
Lest we forget your country was on the other side in WWII.



You are such a tool, sometimes. He's an American citizen. He's also a citizen of Italy, and is of Italian descent.

What is this poop about 'his country' having been on the 'other side in WWII'? What does that have to do with anything or with HIM?

What sort of weak debater says something like this? "You're of German descent and you know, Germany was on the other side and it lost. So, whatever you say is wrong, cause . . . you're German."
Nomarchy
Spreading democratic governance . . . so that's what the United Nations (i.e. the Allies) were doing in WWII?

Were they freeing peoples and nations in the colonies in Africa and Asia, as well?

Were we spreading democratic governance and freedom in our Southern States during WWII?

Spreading democratic governance . . . if WWII was about 'democratic' vs 'authoritarian governance' then the U.S. Civil War was about "States' rights". Of course, you believe the latter, as well, so there's basically no hope that you will ever, ever, ever be willing to actually look at history dispassionately and honestly.
Bart Katz
QUOTE (SpaceCowboy @ Mar 14 2008, 03:03 PM) *
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/barack-obama...ch_b_91623.html



I love the way Obama just denies the "controversial" statements.

Oh, and by the way, if that uppity preacher said anything like that while Obama was in church he must have been asleep.


I don't believe the good Rev "God Damn America" Wright is going away any time soon.
Bart Katz
QUOTE (SherryB @ Mar 14 2008, 03:22 PM) *
The reason for the "black separatist" church is that blacks were not allowed in the white churches. Tradition. History. Not uppity, honest. That church was founded in the 18th century.


They must not be playing Wright's rants on CNN.
SherryB
QUOTE (Bart Katz @ Mar 14 2008, 07:21 PM) *
They must not be playing Wright's rants on CNN.


Over and over and over. I think it pales in comparison to what Falwell and Robertson said about 9/11, aids. et al being God's punishment. At least Obama's preacher served in the miliary, Marine, and spent the rest of his life trying to get social justice.

IMO.
SherryB


Obama was just interviewed by Keith Olbermann on MSNBC about this topic. He knows it will be shown over and over. Keith said that every time they show it, show McCain hugging Falwell.

Repub_Bub
QUOTE (SherryB @ Mar 14 2008, 05:42 PM) *
At least Obama's preacher served in the miliary, Marine, and spent the rest of his life trying to get social justice.

IMO.

laugh.gif laugh.gif laugh.gif
Innocent
QUOTE (SpaceCowboy @ Mar 14 2008, 05:03 PM) *
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/barack-obama...ch_b_91623.html

I love the way Obama just denies the "controversial" statements.


I'm sure he wouldn't want to deny the "love your neighbor" type statements. Just those where he disagrees with his pastor.

smile.gif
Bart Katz
QUOTE (Innocent @ Mar 14 2008, 06:51 PM) *
I'm sure he wouldn't want to deny the "love your neighbor" type statements. Just those where he disagrees with his pastor.

smile.gif


Sorting those out may be beyond their ability.
Innocent
QUOTE (Lord_Proprietor @ Mar 14 2008, 06:08 PM) *
Tell Us Which Pastor Wright Sermons You Agree With, Senator

Just what part of this stuff shaped your views

Where's the Sunshine and Hope?


Certainly no secret. Read his book. Or the column.

smile.gif
Repub_Bub
QUOTE (Innocent @ Mar 14 2008, 05:54 PM) *
Certainly no secret. Read his book. Or the column.

smile.gif

I liked O'Reilley's show...you could get the full flavor from the video. smile.gif
Innocent
QUOTE (Bart Katz @ Mar 14 2008, 07:20 PM) *
I don't believe the good Rev "God Damn America" Wright is going away any time soon.


He's already being replaced.

YouTube Video: Fact Check: Reverend Otis Moss on Obama's Faith

smile.gif
Bart Katz
QUOTE (Innocent @ Mar 14 2008, 06:59 PM) *


Not what I meant. But old news anyway.
Arturo_Vandelay
QUOTE (Bart Katz @ Mar 14 2008, 04:20 PM) *
I don't believe the good Rev "God Damn America" Wright is going away any time soon.


He's saying the same thing a lot of lefties say and think. A little louder and a little more obnoxiously perhaps. I doubt Obama loses a single supporter over it, but come November some moderates will remember.
Innocent
QUOTE (SherryB @ Mar 14 2008, 08:42 PM) *
Over and over and over. I think it pales in comparison to what Falwell and Robertson said about 9/11, aids. et al being God's punishment. At least Obama's preacher served in the miliary, Marine, and spent the rest of his life trying to get social justice.

IMO.


It also pales against McCains cozy relationship with the rabidly anti-Catholic and Anti-Jewish John Hagee and his genocidal Anti-Muslim "spiritual advisor" Rod Parsley.
Bart Katz
QUOTE (Arturo_Vandelay @ Mar 14 2008, 07:02 PM) *
He's saying the same thing a lot of lefties say and think. A little louder and a little more obnoxiously perhaps. I doubt Obama loses a single supporter over it, but come November some moderates will remember.


Nah, it won't affect the dem-o-graphics.
Bart Katz
QUOTE (Innocent @ Mar 14 2008, 07:07 PM) *
It also pales against McCains cozy relationship with the rabidly anti-Catholic and Anti-JewishJohn Hagee and his genocidal Anti-Muslim "spiritual advisor" Rod Parsley.


Yeah all that trumps "God Damn America and all you American mother farkers". Sure does. rolleyes.gif rolleyes.gif
Repub_Bub
QUOTE (Arturo_Vandelay @ Mar 14 2008, 06:02 PM) *
He's saying the same thing a lot of lefties say and think. A little louder and a little more obnoxiously perhaps. I doubt Obama loses a single supporter over it, but come November some moderates will remember.

According to O'Reilley it will be a significant thorn at a minimum...the "moral majority" is more likely a pool of individuals rather than some cohesive group.
Innocent
QUOTE (Bart Katz @ Mar 14 2008, 09:09 PM) *
Yeah all that trumps "God Damn America and all you American mother farkers". Sure does. rolleyes.gif rolleyes.gif


Yeah, the desire for genocide (McCains "spiritual advisor Rod Parsley) trumps a belief that God may not favor America because of it's perceived sins - a belief quite common among evangelical fundamentalist Protestants that make up the base of the Republican Party. I certainly wouldn’t agree with his view any more than I would the same view as expressed by the Religious Right. It’s interesting that such different theological perspectives nevertheless share this sad commonality. Both Robertson and Falwell have made similar statements - that God will punish America by hurricane or meteor, etc., because it doesn't share their particular version of their particular belief system.

smile.gif
Bart Katz
QUOTE (Innocent @ Mar 14 2008, 07:17 PM) *
Yeah, the desire for genocide (McCains "spiritual advisor Rod Parsley) trumps a belief that God may not favor America because of it's perceived sins - a belief quite common among evangelical fundamentalist Protestants that make up the base of the Republican Party. I certainly wouldn’t agree with his view any more than I would the same view as expressed by the Religious Right. It’s interesting that such different theological perspectives nevertheless share this sad commonality. Both Robertson and Falwell have made similar statements - that God will punish America by hurricane or meteor, etc., because it doesn't share their particular version of their particular belief system.

smile.gif


Too bad you haven't said already that you don't agree with his views. I guess if any of those people were on McCain's campaign staff I'd be concerned. But then you only hear what you want to hear since you're a half deaf, half blind lefty. If you can't have your silly equivocation, you don't have anything.
Innocent
QUOTE (Bart Katz @ Mar 14 2008, 09:20 PM) *
Too bad you haven't said already that you don't agree with his views.


I just did.

QUOTE (Bart Katz @ Mar 14 2008, 09:20 PM) *
I guess if any of those people were on McCain's campaign staff I'd be concerned.


Then start being concerned. McCain claims that Rod Parsley is his "spiritual advisor."

smile.gif

Bart Katz
QUOTE (Innocent @ Mar 14 2008, 07:28 PM) *
I just did.



Then start being concerned. McCain claims that Rod Parsley is his "spiritual advisor."

smile.gif


Finally.
Repub_Bub
QUOTE (Innocent @ Mar 14 2008, 06:17 PM) *
Yeah, the desire for genocide (McCains "spiritual advisor Rod Parsley) trumps a belief that God may not favor America because of it's perceived sins - a belief quite common among evangelical fundamentalist Protestants that make up the base of the Republican Party. I certainly wouldn’t agree with his view any more than I would the same view as expressed by the Religious Right. It’s interesting that such different theological perspectives nevertheless share this sad commonality. Both Robertson and Falwell have made similar statements - that God will punish America by hurricane or meteor, etc., because it doesn't share their particular version of their particular belief system.

smile.gif

I dunno if you live in left field or spend all your time in the lab but your conclusions almost always have the quality of forced deductions from imagined premises...reminiscent of Friend Judy. smile.gif

Bart Katz
A belief quite common among evangelical fundamentalist God Damn American mother farking white Protestants that make up the base of the Republican Party
Davis 2.0
QUOTE (SherryB @ Mar 14 2008, 04:10 PM) *
You have a black hole for a soul.



Don't worry Sherry. Let the racist ass holes in the Republican party go berserk. Funny thing about handling poison all day and night, they end up killing themselves.
Davis 2.0
QUOTE (Bart Katz @ Mar 14 2008, 05:20 PM) *
I don't believe the good Rev "God Damn America" Wright is going away any time soon.



Well of course. You rightwankers are going to scream this from the pulpit, congress, your pig pen, ect.

Bring it on mojo.
Innocent
QUOTE (Repub_Bub @ Mar 14 2008, 09:30 PM) *
I dunno if you live in left field or spend all your time in the lab but your conclusions almost always have the quality of forced deductions from imagined premises...reminiscent of Friend Judy. smile.gif


You're not familiar with the various claims by the religious right that their God would punish various cities, or America generally, for the "sins" they believe America to be guilty of? It's certainly an easy process to locate information about these statements.

smile.gif
Innocent
QUOTE (Davis 2.0 @ Mar 14 2008, 09:54 PM) *
Don't worry Sherry. Let the racist ass holes in the Republican party go berserk. Funny thing about handling poison all day and night, they end up killing themselves.


Yes, exactly. I hope they don't suddenly change.

smile.gif
inyerface
like underwear?

I think they better change somethin
Repub_Bub
QUOTE (Innocent @ Mar 14 2008, 07:05 PM) *
You're not familiar with the various claims by the religious right that their God would punish various cities, or America generally, for the "sins" they believe America to be guilty of? It's certainly an easy process to locate information about these statements.

smile.gif

I'm familiar with them but they are not the "widespread viewpoints held by the religious right" that you would like to believe.

Essentially, there are substantial numbers of normal Christians believing normal Christian doctrine...these folks will be representing the REAL "moral majority".

The day that these folks are truly outnumbered is the day America dies.
Davis 2.0
laugh.gif laugh.gif laugh.gif laugh.gif laugh.gif
Repub_Bub
QUOTE (Davis 2.0 @ Mar 14 2008, 07:21 PM) *
laugh.gif laugh.gif laugh.gif laugh.gif laugh.gif

Don't you have some vomit that needs revisiting? smile.gif
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